Hi people,<br />
I created a site using frames on a 15" monitor, but soon found out the frames won't expand when viewed in a 19" monitor. I need a solution big time. I am currently experiencing with tables, but am afraid they aren't going to do the job either.<br />
One requirement in case you start to think about this.<br />
The page has a horizontal navigation bar at the top (29 pixels in height) which I want to remain at all times during viewing links, sites, etc.,in the lower section of the page. <br />
Also note this; when you first get to this page, you see some scattered graphics in the lower section as a homepage in other words, but these are in a table at the time along with the navigation bar (which is a nested table). Take a look at the frame version if you can get to it-www.bassanglersofsandiego.pair.com- got to the second page (moonphase page). THe page needs a lot of work.<!--content-->I think you should be talking screen res and not inches.<br />
<br />
This reply was one I did for another thread... some pointers for you.<br />
<br />
800*600 is what I would aim for. If anyone is still surfing at any res less then forget them. Most surfers now surf at 800*600 or above. Could get into some deep discussion about it but there is no point going back to anything less. Don't think I have ever seen a web page in such a long time consider widths of anything less.<br />
<br />
As for 800 width, this means you design at 750 considering tool bars etc in Macs and PC's and the various browsers. <br />
<br />
Feel embaressed about posting this again, but what follows is an old post that I feel is relavent.<br />
<br />
<br />
There are four main factors that will determine how a site is percieved, these being: <br />
<br />
Screen Size <br />
Screen Res <br />
Browser <br />
Platform (ie Mac, Web TV or PC) <br />
<br />
<br />
I hope screen size doesn't need explaining but to say that in my experiance people using 17" and 19" monitors at home still view sites at a 800*600 res... only because they don't know how to ajust the res. <br />
<br />
Screen res is an important function to plan for when writing a site. The res to design for is 800*600. Most surfers view at this res (51%), but that doesn't mean some surfers don't surf at 640*480 (6%). I think it safe to ignore the latter though. Often over looked is the live space of a screen. <br />
<br />
A browser affects the live space. Just because a screen res is 800*600, that doesn't mean you get that to play with. Live space is the space you have when tool bars etc are removed. The lowest live space you should design for is (accounting for Netscape/Explorer) 778*406 on a pc and 751*427 on a mac, that is obviously at a 800*600 screen res. Various versions of explorer and netscape have diffrent live spaces, those just quoted would be the lowest of versions 5+. Combining these two you get 751*406. <br />
<br />
As you can see, the software changes the display. Hardware will also chnge the display. From the last paragraph you will see that PC's and Macs work a little differently. But there is a 3rd and much overlooked way of connecting to the web. Via a TV. TV's to put it bluntly are crap for internet viewing and interactivity. But people are buying more and more of them as an alternative to hogging up a PC or because they are cheaper. I am not sure what a web tv screen res would be, but the live space is 544*378. I would never design for web tv, but that depends on your content. If you are interested in more on web tv go to: <br />
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://developer.webtv.net">http://developer.webtv.net</a><!-- m --> <br />
<br />
As for your question as I may have digressed a little... <br />
<br />
There are two ways to combat the various diplays in a design aspect. <br />
<br />
1] Design your page at a fixed width, ie at a 800*600 res, with a live space of 751*406. This way mac and pc viewers will have no problem with your site. Perhaps the best way to start the design is with a table, width set to 751... and include everything inside that. <br />
<br />
2] The alternative is to dynamically author your site so that your page expands to fill the user area. If you do this... design your page with your monitor at 800*600 res then tweak it at a higher res. Why? The page may look great at a low res but empty at a higher res. <br />
<br />
I hope that gives you some insight and some design ideas. <br />
More than anything I hope it made sense.<!--content-->As for your frames... there should be no reason why they wont render. It will not react due to screen size but screen res. A website should render almost the same on a 15" and 19" if both are set to 800*600 pixels.<br />
<br />
Post some code for your source and we can have a look at what you mean.<!--content-->1] Design your page at a fixed width, ie at a 800*600 res, with a live space of 751*406. This way mac and pc viewers will have no problem with your site. Perhaps the best way to start the design is with a table, width set to 751... and include everything inside that.<br />
<br />
Did that. <br />
<br />
2] The alternative is to dynamically author your site so that your page expands to fill the user area. If you do this... design your page with your monitor at 800*600 res then tweak it at a higher res. Why? The page may look great at a low res but empty at a higher res. <br />
<br />
Kinda did that. I got it full of graphics now and it fills up my 15" monitor with the res set at 800x600 (hoping as viewers monitor sizes grow to 19 and even 21" the graphics will span out a little.<br />
<br />
I hope that gives you some insight and some design ideas. <br />
More than anything I hope it made sense.<br />
<br />
THanks for posting, your help is greatly appreciatted. Sounds like I'm on the right track though. I just need to figure out how to use the lower table as a viewable area with a scrollbar.<!--content-->
I created a site using frames on a 15" monitor, but soon found out the frames won't expand when viewed in a 19" monitor. I need a solution big time. I am currently experiencing with tables, but am afraid they aren't going to do the job either.<br />
One requirement in case you start to think about this.<br />
The page has a horizontal navigation bar at the top (29 pixels in height) which I want to remain at all times during viewing links, sites, etc.,in the lower section of the page. <br />
Also note this; when you first get to this page, you see some scattered graphics in the lower section as a homepage in other words, but these are in a table at the time along with the navigation bar (which is a nested table). Take a look at the frame version if you can get to it-www.bassanglersofsandiego.pair.com- got to the second page (moonphase page). THe page needs a lot of work.<!--content-->I think you should be talking screen res and not inches.<br />
<br />
This reply was one I did for another thread... some pointers for you.<br />
<br />
800*600 is what I would aim for. If anyone is still surfing at any res less then forget them. Most surfers now surf at 800*600 or above. Could get into some deep discussion about it but there is no point going back to anything less. Don't think I have ever seen a web page in such a long time consider widths of anything less.<br />
<br />
As for 800 width, this means you design at 750 considering tool bars etc in Macs and PC's and the various browsers. <br />
<br />
Feel embaressed about posting this again, but what follows is an old post that I feel is relavent.<br />
<br />
<br />
There are four main factors that will determine how a site is percieved, these being: <br />
<br />
Screen Size <br />
Screen Res <br />
Browser <br />
Platform (ie Mac, Web TV or PC) <br />
<br />
<br />
I hope screen size doesn't need explaining but to say that in my experiance people using 17" and 19" monitors at home still view sites at a 800*600 res... only because they don't know how to ajust the res. <br />
<br />
Screen res is an important function to plan for when writing a site. The res to design for is 800*600. Most surfers view at this res (51%), but that doesn't mean some surfers don't surf at 640*480 (6%). I think it safe to ignore the latter though. Often over looked is the live space of a screen. <br />
<br />
A browser affects the live space. Just because a screen res is 800*600, that doesn't mean you get that to play with. Live space is the space you have when tool bars etc are removed. The lowest live space you should design for is (accounting for Netscape/Explorer) 778*406 on a pc and 751*427 on a mac, that is obviously at a 800*600 screen res. Various versions of explorer and netscape have diffrent live spaces, those just quoted would be the lowest of versions 5+. Combining these two you get 751*406. <br />
<br />
As you can see, the software changes the display. Hardware will also chnge the display. From the last paragraph you will see that PC's and Macs work a little differently. But there is a 3rd and much overlooked way of connecting to the web. Via a TV. TV's to put it bluntly are crap for internet viewing and interactivity. But people are buying more and more of them as an alternative to hogging up a PC or because they are cheaper. I am not sure what a web tv screen res would be, but the live space is 544*378. I would never design for web tv, but that depends on your content. If you are interested in more on web tv go to: <br />
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://developer.webtv.net">http://developer.webtv.net</a><!-- m --> <br />
<br />
As for your question as I may have digressed a little... <br />
<br />
There are two ways to combat the various diplays in a design aspect. <br />
<br />
1] Design your page at a fixed width, ie at a 800*600 res, with a live space of 751*406. This way mac and pc viewers will have no problem with your site. Perhaps the best way to start the design is with a table, width set to 751... and include everything inside that. <br />
<br />
2] The alternative is to dynamically author your site so that your page expands to fill the user area. If you do this... design your page with your monitor at 800*600 res then tweak it at a higher res. Why? The page may look great at a low res but empty at a higher res. <br />
<br />
I hope that gives you some insight and some design ideas. <br />
More than anything I hope it made sense.<!--content-->As for your frames... there should be no reason why they wont render. It will not react due to screen size but screen res. A website should render almost the same on a 15" and 19" if both are set to 800*600 pixels.<br />
<br />
Post some code for your source and we can have a look at what you mean.<!--content-->1] Design your page at a fixed width, ie at a 800*600 res, with a live space of 751*406. This way mac and pc viewers will have no problem with your site. Perhaps the best way to start the design is with a table, width set to 751... and include everything inside that.<br />
<br />
Did that. <br />
<br />
2] The alternative is to dynamically author your site so that your page expands to fill the user area. If you do this... design your page with your monitor at 800*600 res then tweak it at a higher res. Why? The page may look great at a low res but empty at a higher res. <br />
<br />
Kinda did that. I got it full of graphics now and it fills up my 15" monitor with the res set at 800x600 (hoping as viewers monitor sizes grow to 19 and even 21" the graphics will span out a little.<br />
<br />
I hope that gives you some insight and some design ideas. <br />
More than anything I hope it made sense.<br />
<br />
THanks for posting, your help is greatly appreciatted. Sounds like I'm on the right track though. I just need to figure out how to use the lower table as a viewable area with a scrollbar.<!--content-->